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Music stands for choral singersDate: April 16, 2009 by Felipe Gasper  Views: 5798
Hi all,
What are folks’ opinions of having individual singers use music stands, in rehearsals and/or performances? It seems relatively few choirs do it, but I wonder if it’s just something that hasn’t “caught on”?
Or, have some of you tried it and decided it wasn’t worth it? Replies (13): Threaded | Chronological
David Topping on April 16, 2009 10:00am
I think this works with smaller ensembles, but could become unwieldy with larger ones, mostly due to the physical space issues. I used stands with a group of less than 20 singers, and we stood in a semi-circle.
on April 16, 2009 10:19am
Outside of school, in Symphony chorus, I use a stand. For long rehearsals they are fabulous.
I started using stands in school this semester. Some classes really like them. Some don't. Those who don't (women's chorus) feel that they get in the way of communication.
I'm going to keep trying them during the rehearsal process, however. Since my students have to memorize their music for concerts, we do have time for rehearsing without the stands "being in the way."
on April 16, 2009 10:33am
I'd say that first it depends on the size of your group and
your rehearsal room - at some point individual stands just become
impractical.
I have used them for groups of 33 and smaller (not that 33 is an upper limit - I just haven't had an occasion to use them with a larger group) with a very positive result. Mainly, the singers stand (or sit) in better posture. I've rehearsed groups of this size standing in a circle. I think using stands is just not part of the "choral musician
mindset" so we tend not to think about using them. If you have
enough stands, and enough space to use them without creating
sightline or crowding issues, I definitely would vote for using
them.
on April 16, 2009 12:46pm
Interesting question, Felipe, and interesting replies thus far. As I think about it, the ensemble size is very definitely a limiting factor. The Kings Singers do use music stands when they perform with an orchestra. Chanticleer never does. But that brings up a second factor: Chantilceer performs most of their music from memory and not from scores on stage.
For conductors who feel that proximity for their singers is very important, stands are contra-indicated because they take up space and force people to become more spread out. My singers (a very small early music motet choir) do use stands in rehearsals, but never on stage, and they do NOT sing from memory. But of course they also often sit in rehearsals, and do not in performances.
There is also, if you decide to use stands, the question of using individual stands or of reading at most 2 to a stand, as string players always do. And THAT brings up the question of sightlines between the choristers and the conductor, which most of us would consider pretty important.
My own feeling is that music stands form a barrier between the performer and the audience, that singers with two functioning hands need to use those hands to hold their music and turn pages, and that raising the stands to the level necessary to keep the singers' eyes properly raised on on the conductor forms not just a barrier but a brick wall between the choristers and the audience, especially if they are on a stage raised above audience level. Others, of course, may disagree.
And finally, there is the cost, around $200 for a six-pack of standard Manhassett orchestral stands, which would NOT be a trivial factor for many choruses, especially the larger ones.
As anyone knows who has sung in very traditional churches, especially those which use kneelers, the choirloft is often supplied not with music stands but with a rail in front of each row of singers designed to hold both music and books. This can be very handy when juggling music, hymnals, prayerbooks, and the like, and is convenient when they choir sings seated, but when they stand (as for an anthem) they still must hold their music in their hands in order to watch the conductor.
Interesting question indeed!
John
on April 16, 2009 2:41pm
I use them for two of my groups and the singers love having their > shoulders > and arms free of the weight so they can concentrate their energy on > their > singing. It does take away from the visual element, but for a small > chamber > group it's perfect, and actually lends a certain "musicianship" > credibility if you will... > I just saw the Tallis Scholars using small stands that were not at the > height of their faces, which held all the music they were singing > except the > piece at hand, which they held in their hands. That was a good > solution I > thought.
on April 17, 2009 4:37am
interesting question. and such lovely diversity in the responses. most appear to be coming from the director's viewpoint. as a singer, i recently had the use of a music stand during seated rehearsals. i found it less stressful on the shoulders but more on the neck as my head needed to bob up and down to see the director. i felt confined, and in a cramped position. my freedom of movement was severely restricted. i believe most choral singers who do not memorize music prefer having the music in hand and at 'eye' level [there will always be exceptions for those unable to stand for long periods or who function with other physical restrictions]. i am able to express the music more fully when i am standing, with folder in hand, than sitting behind a music stand.
and let me add a further comment regarding all of the lovely outfits we so graciously wear that would be hidden behind stands. at 4'11'', i would surely be lost in the visual with a metal stand in front of me - and i'm egotistical enought that i want to be 'seen as well as heard'!
on April 17, 2009 9:47am
Bonnie Azzelino wrote:
"interesting question. and such lovely diversity in the responses. most appear to be coming from the director's viewpoint. as a singer, i recently had the use of a music stand during seated rehearsals. i found it less stressful on the shoulders but more on the neck as my head needed to bob up and down to see the director. i felt confined, and in a cramped position. my freedom of movement was severely restricted."
Yes Bonnie, that's what I was referring to. The basic problem is that music stand desks are about 12.5" high (that's the measurement for the Manhassett orchestral stands), and choral scores are what, about 8" tall or a little less? So using orchestral stands creates the barrier I mentioned when you place choral scores on them. And NOBODY (that I know of) makes a choral stand with a shorter desk. So if eye contact is important, music stands just get in the way.
"and let me add a further comment regarding all of the lovely outfits we so graciously wear that would be hidden behind stands. at 4'11'', i would surely be lost in the visual with a metal stand in front of me - and i'm egotistical enought that i want to be 'seen as well as heard'!"
Hey Bonnie, you're my kind of person. My late wife was 4' 10", and I understand completely!
P.S. I know we've all been getting naked emails with no quotations to put our replies in context. I've just proved that you can copy and paste enough of the message you're replying to to give other readers a hint of the context. Unfortunately the new system doesn't do that automatically, and you have to insert your own quotation marks to make it clear what's quoted and what are you own comments, but at least it's possible in this new and less friendly environment.
on April 17, 2009 6:38am
After several years' absence, I recently returned to Germany to sing with Helmuth Rilling's Gaechinger Kantorei. We were performing Handel's "Israel in Egypt." They now use music stands in rehearsal and performance. This was my first time working this way, and it was wonderful! Especially with a heavy score, it is much less fatiguing using a stand--no shoulder tension. This was a forty-five voice ensemble with orchestra, and the sightlines were no problem. I will use them whenever possible from now on. Peter Hopkins, Philadelphia
on April 17, 2009 10:40am
In our small church choir (about 18 or so people) we have one member who uses a stand. She is totally deaf, so she sings using sign rather than with her voice. She obviously needs the stand. We wouldn't have enough stands at church for the rest to use the stands. Of course, the director uses one. In my school choir, we have class in the band room and quite a few of them do enjoy using stands as we rehearse. By concert time, they are not needing them as all of our songs are memorized.
-- Darlene
on April 20, 2010 6:46pm
I direct a choir of 15+ women in "show choir" (kind of) style. We use stands and have had lots of discussion on whether to get rid of the stands. Mostly, it is very beneficial. We have
First, you don't have to hold a heavy book. We sing about 15-20 songs for one hour, and that would be difficult to hold a book.
We also have lots of actions and connecting to the audience. For instances we do "Broadway Ladies" medley with Whatever Lola Wants, Hey Big Spender, & another. The audience loves this song, and part of the grab is that we milk the actions. These are women from age 20-80, and they can draw in an audience like you would not believe.
We hang our costume gear from the stands which kind of decorates our "stage" - hippy beads (California Dreamin,etc), cowboy hats (Happy Trails etc), boas (Lola etc), safari hats (Lion Sleeps) and other items that we quickly change for our songs.
We have speakers that say things between songs, getting the audience to connect with us, and speakers notes are taped into the music.
Our singers feel more confident with the music. As they get familiar, we give them cheat sheets with just the words and a few guides (like "soft" "loud" "rest,2,3,4") and many singers switch to the cheat sheets.
Only faults would be that they can get in the way and SOME shy singers forget to get their eyes out of the music!
on April 20, 2010 10:09pm
Hi, Carol. You seem to have picked up on a year-old thread here, but your questions are very valid ones. And my answers are PURE personal opinion, although opinion about which I feel rather strongly.
My most important question for you is this: do you do a "concert," or do you do a "show"? From what you say, it sound to me like a show. And NO entertainers doing ANY kind of show uses either music, a script, or music stands on stage. It's a given that performers will be "off book" before going before the public. And I think the reason is pretty simple. A show involves character acting (which it sounds like your women do very well!), and acting isn't convincing unless it seems sponaneous and "in character." So my advice would be simple: no music, no scripts, no notes, no stands, no how! A concert is totally different. Some conductors have traditionally insisted on having the music memorized; most do not these days, when most concerts are performed only once or just a few times. But the kind of theatricality you describe goes way beyond a concert presentation.
Now admittedly my own rather widely varied background drives my opinions. Twenty years in a quartet that started out barbershop and ended up with a vocal/instrumental/comedy act--no music on stage. Director of a women's show group at Indiana University for several years--no music on stage. Director of the All American College Singers shows at both Disney parks--no music on stage. Fourteen years here as director of a fine university show group doing an average of 30 shows a year--no music on stage. Director of a Sweet Adelines barbershop chorus for 2 years--no music on stage. Nineteen years this summer involved in community musical theater--no music on stage. And at the same time I've also been involved in choral, orchestral, instrumental, and early music concerts at different levels, as well as playing in the pit for a number of our musicals, and of COURSE music and stands are used in those cases. That why I ask whether you consider your performances concerts or shows.
With my show group here (22 singer/dancers--11 couples; a 12-piece showband; a full Technical Staff) we put our touring show together in an intensive 10-day workshop before classes began in the fall, and gave our first perfromances for incoming Freshmen the day before classes began. And one of the necessities was to take every new number from sightreading to memorization to blocking and choreographing to on stage with the showband in those 10 days. The same general approach with The All American College Singers. That's how shows are put together, and I'm quite sure your women are perectly capable of doing the same. You just have to allow sufficient rehearsal time to internalize both the scripts and the music of course, just as any and every theatrical production does.
All the best,
John
P.S. I like your use of props and accessories to fit the different routines, but they can certainly be hung from freestanding coat racks that can be placed at the sides of your stages rather than placed in the middle of things like music stands. And I assume that you are not also using mics and mic stands and cables, which would add yet another layer of complexity to your stage movement.
on April 25, 2010 7:40pm
Wow ... thanks for the advice and for picking up on the old thread. If I could only get my ladies so confident. I think they are capable; They're not so sure! Yes we definately consider it a show not a concert (we do Wash That Man Right Outta My Hair and such, and never classical music:) We don't move about on stage though, and in fact don't ever have a stage. All our actions are in place, sometimes free-form and sometimes in unison. We sing in the nursing homes, VA auditoriums, senior centers, etc. We don't use mics since we are in smaller venues ... another reason not to have music stands to save space. All of our actions are in place, more like the Sweet Adelines. I was with them for quite a while previously and started this little group just because I didn't like driving 2 hours in the dark on Dakota's winter roads every week. We typically work totally as a group, voting on things. And our group decided we wanted to be all about friendships and connecting to the audiences (& music of course) but not worried about perfection and competions as is the case with some groups. I love the idea of racks on the sides to hold some of the gear. Thanks for the confidence ... to go pass on to my ladies!
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