Sally:  I have to ask, WHO is placing these kids in your choir?  Sounds like an administrative fiat, and sounds as if you are not allowed to have auditions until AFTER the roster is complete.  And of course that's a receipe for disaster, as you've discovered.  There is NO WAY to hide drone voices!

 

This is a battle worth fighting your administrators over.  If they want non-singers in a choir, they have to provide a second training choir for them.  If they can't do that, and if they won't allow you to audition and select your singers, you don't belong in that school!

 

The men's barbershop organization used to have 5 voice classification:  lead, tenor, bari, bass, and "crow," for those who enjoyed the social aspects of the organization but could not AND WERE NOT ALLOWED to sing in public. 

 

Are there other social factors involved in creating this situation that you haven't told us about?  Mainstreaming or Inclusion policies, for example?  Or is this some administrator saying "everybody can sing"?  Well, you'e the professional, and you have to explain the difference between inclusion as in everyone has the opportunity to try out, and inclusion as in let anyone who feels like it play on the football team without givng the coach the authority to pick and choose.  There's a solid pedagogical reason for having JV teams, and for having lower-demanding choirs for kids who really need more help to become qualified to sing in choir.

 

For whatever it's worth,

 

John

 

 

John: This kind of comment: "The men's barbershop organization used to have 5 voice classification: lead, tenor, bari, bass, and "crow," for those who enjoyed the social aspects of the organization but could not AND WERE NOT ALLOWED to sing in public." does not help anyone, never has.

Sally: I applaud your desire to work with these kids. My university room mate was 'tone deaf' so he said - with a bit of work I showed him it was a skill he could learn. Have you tried having them 'feel' the pitch they are trying to match. I would try the vibrations coming off a cello, hand on the back of a piano, you get the idea.

Placing them in the choir - I mix them in and get them to share music with someone they like who can match pitch. Go with the sports analogy if it works - we learn how to dribble a ball, swing a bat --- blend, pitch match --- we can learn that too.

I get the 'loud' folks with a strong partner also matching kids with similar voice colour sometimes helps. Move them around in the group - I find there is no set rule for front or back of the choir - I just rely on my ears.

I find the benefits of working with these challenging situations often gains rewards - some of the benefits we will never be aware of in terms of a kid's self esteem, learning to tackle challenges etc. etc. Often these folks have become the kids I rely on for set up, help with publicity etc.

Blessings Sally! L.

 Hi Sally, 

 

It depends on the student, but as a rule I try to put them in front of the strong singers so he can hear the part initially. As time goes on, sometimes I will move him to the top riser on the outside corner.  That way he will have to listen harder and sing softer to hear the strong singers.

 

But,,,, I am sorry, I would never ask a student not to sing.. I just believe that is completely against what I stand for as a choral director.  I know that it takes time for some students to be able to match pitch and then be able to manipulate the voice to get on that pitch at the right times.  I will ask them to sing softly so he/she can hear the rest of the choir.  I talk about listening to the choir and not just for their own voice.  

 

Also, unless you are in a large district that supports the arts, it is unlikely to have a special "training" choir to put those "non singers".  I have singers and nonsingers in my beginning choir and have to figure out how to make it work.  Then if students still are not able to match pitch after the first year, I do not move them to a higher level choir.  If all I was willing to take in choir were "singers", I would have a hard time filling a class.  It is my job to make anyone who has the desire to become a singer, which I believe is possible.... Anyone can sing and be a good choir member... being a good choir member is not the same as being the "idol" singer...

 

Good luck, I am sure that as the teacher getting to know the students, you will make the right decision.   We all have to make those decisions and judgements based on the singers we have and the program that we are given to work within.

 

Clydene Balke

Glendale, AZ

Hi, Sally,

 

I teach in a Waldorf High School where chorus is required for all the students.  I have 60 students in chorus this year.  We do very challenging music and I absolutely love this work.  Over the years I have had a number of students who could not match pitch.  This year, as it happens,  I have only one.  She really wants to improve so I work with her for five minutes after class twice a week.  She is finally really making progress.  It is amazing though how much the students learn by simply participating as best they can.  They do learn from the students around them.  I tell the students who say they hate singing, that there is no way for me to really know if they are really singing or just mouthing the words, but I will notice if they are not appearing to sing.  I find that it is easier for them to sing than not to sing and that over time they come to enjoy the experience.  I do try to place the "drones" next to strong singers and well within their section rather than on the periphery.  I find the front row is the worst place for them because they feel so exposed, so somewhere in the middle works the best.

 

Don't give up.  Try various solutions and encourage as much as you can.

 

Katie

Thank you to all who have offered suggestions.  I have tried many of the things you've suggested, and in fact, had two boys at the beginning of the year who couldn't match pitches.  Now I only have one, so the things that I've done have been successful for the other one!  I'm hopeful that with some added help, my "crow" or "drone" will be matching pitches next year!  (I just "auditioned" new students for next year, and have another boy that has an even more limited range of pitch matching!  More challenges!)

 

I've "placed" both of them in various positions in the choir, but found that putting them next to a strong bass who can stay on his pitch has been the most helpful.  I've never told a student not to sing, but instead have encouraged ALL singers in my choirs to listen carefully to the people around them.  If they can't hear EVERYONE around them singing, they may be singing too loud.  I may even pull that student aside outside of class time and ask them to really listen the next day and make sure they're hearing everyone else in their section.  When they are specifically asked to listen, two things happen; first, they are more aware of what is going on around them and aren't singing quite as loud, and second, they are listening to "in-tune" singing.  The benefits of that alone are worth it!

 

Again, thank you for your replies and responses.  I've enjoyed reading them and appreciate your thoughts.  I hope that other directors use these forums the same way I do - to bring up topics that might generate some discussion and suggestions that might be helpful to me AND to others.  I've been teaching for many years, and have had many situations like the one I've asked about in this thread.  And, I've dealt with them in various ways, and had good and "less than good" results.  So, when a situation comes up, either in my classroom, or in my thoughts, I bring it to the experts here at ChoralNet, hoping that it will get people thinking, and that I may also glean something that will be helpful to me.  I'm always ready to learn something new or different!  I hope that's how others use the forums as well.  Thanks!!!

 

Sally